Beginners’ vs. Advanced Ego Death

https://effectindex.com/effects/ego-death#subjective-differences-between-various-substances –

“Dissociative ego death is less likely to cause an anxious response for those who are inexperienced compared to psychedelic ego death.

“… many people experience dissociatives as inherently calming and tranquil, while high doses of psychedelics are quite often experienced as the opposite.”

“Psychedelic ego death … intense and often overwhelming nature. … elevate the subjective intensity and transpersonal significance of ego death experiences.

Two Versions of Unity Experience

I distinguish 2 versions of “unity consciousness” experience:

From my notes below on the “Unity and interconnectedness” section of video:

beginners’ sensation of unity, but unearned, {trespassing}, and {impure} and impious {pollution}, because unstable use of & reliance on the naive possibilism mental model.

the advanced kind of unity after repudiating relying on naive possibilism-thinking.

Two Versions of Ego Death Experience

From my notes below on the “Ego death” section of video:

I distinguish 2 versions of “ego death” experience:

beginners’ suspension/dissolution

advanced active cancellation; cybernetic control violation per Eadwine’s {blade}

Effects Index: Ego Death

url https://effectindex.com/effects/ego-death

Stop fighting the loss of control, and surrender to the experience of ego death.

https://effectindex.com/effects/ego-death#fear%20of%20losing%20control

Transpersonal Effects

https://effectindex.com/categories/transpersonal-effects

• Ego death
• Existential self-realization
• Perception of eternalism
• Perception of interdependent opposites
• Perception of predeterminism
• Perception of self-design
• Spirituality enhancement
• Unity and interconnectedness

Perception of Eternalism

https://effectindex.com/effects/perception-of-eternalism

“a perspective that is very difficult to shake off after having this experience a number of times.”

” … it is truly fascinating to me that without any prior knowledge, myself and many other psychedelic users can experience incredibly specific states of mind that seem to line up with entire philosophical theories. This holds true for a number of transpersonal effects …”

That’s because these “philosophical theories” came from psilocybin.

Pan 😱 🐐

https://effectindex.com/effects/panic-attack

🍿

Sudden onset of intense fear or terror. Fear of going crazy or losing control. Some great calamity is imminent. A crushing sense of impending doom, accompanied by panic and dread.

When the mind is pulled through the no-free-will Saturn gate into Eternalismland, childish, perishable reliance on naive possibilism-thinking is tested, demonstrated, threatened, found vulnerable, repudiated & jettisoned as a liability, and left behind.

Childish, naive possibilism-thinking is no longer used as something to try to rely on as a defense against seeing too clearly how control works, in the altered state.

Overstating How Much People’s Experience Is Socially Influenced

The Mystical Experience Questionnaire for trips research (on rank newbies) is under scrutiny lately for priming and bias and arbitrariness.

url https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3539773/#S2title

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3539773/#S2title

Over-informed, excessively well-read academics then complain “people are being primed”, though I object: most people have not been primed at all; they just try the substance and see for themselves what it does.

Just because YOU, academics, read 20 books before the experience, doesn’t mean everyone else does.

John Lash similarly makes an insane overreach of granting to Wasson complete ownership of every single idea about religious use of visionary plants that anyone has, even though I had not heard of Wasson (or Allegro) when I read the book of Revelation in 1986 and said “the scroll is a psychedelic, but which one?”

Thomas Hatsis makes the same crude irrational granting of all credit – but to Allegro instead of Wasson.

Hatsis told me that the ONLY reason I assert Psilocybin is because Allegro… as if Allegro had any influence on my thinking, like happened to Hatsis, the true “follower of Allegro”.

John Lash wildly idolizes and pays way too much attention to Wasson, and then he projects his own fanboi fanaticism onto everybody else in the world, and he describes everybody who has any idea, John Lash says that that person is thinking “the Wasson idea”.

Why not call it “the Eadwine/ Reko/ Schultes/ Graves idea”?

Or simply call it with no one’s name, the obvious idea which everyone independently thinks of, including me in 1986.

No one “owns” the idea of entheogens, but Lash is intent on granting total ownership of “the Wasson theory” = the idea of religious use of visionary plants.

Fortunately, no one follows Lash’s atrocious term-usage, just as no one buys Hanegraaff’s harebrained notion of “entheogens in the wide sense” (except Erik Davis, who wrote to Hanegraaff “You’re right, but stay away from redefining & similarly cheapening & ruining our word ‘psychedelics’).

Hanegraaff and Letcher would both disapprove of Lash’s childishly crude and linear “transmission of the idea” model.

Wasson claims to be first at everything, but the French mycologists were 50 years ahead of Wasson’s “original idea” that the Eden tree is Amanita.

Hatsis pays WAY too much attention to Allegro, who isn’t even an entheogen scholar, and then projects his own fanatical fanboism, his radical overestimation of Allegro’s importance, onto everyone else – while ignoring where the 20th C mushroom research came from.

Even fanatical Wasson fanboi John Lash acknowledges that his idol, Wasson, wasn’t first – an admission buried in an endnote about “the word that Wasson coined”, ‘entheogen’.

I find it offensive or insulting, that Michael Pollan says that there is only a single unbiased ergot trip: Hofmann’s first deliberate session.

Everyone else just dumbly copies Huxley’s or Hofmann’s writeup, claims Jan Irvin and Michael Pollan.

You experience what you do (they say) only because you are at the complete mercy of what previous people claim to you that the experience is.

That’s a crude view. You might speak for yourself, not for others on this point.

At the extreme, of that assertion, we get a schizophrenic type of view, as if your thoughts are inserted into your mind remotely by some hidden controller (which is true in a metaphysical or revealed cybernetic sense).

Maybe Huxley and Wasson control YOUR experience. This just indicates to me that YOU have no independence or originality of thought.

Video

Like everybody else, Josie commits the massive error of conflating “the size of your ego” with ego death.

These have precisely jack squat to do with each other.

url https://youtu.be/9jxMSYTTEPE

Below are my own valuations on JK’s phenomena list. -cm

Timestamp links are in the description:

00:00 – Introduction

01:01 – Mystical & Transpersonal Experiences definition

01:36 – Atemporality 👍

02:12 – Ego death 👎👍

url https://effectindex.com/effects/ego-death

https://effectindex.com/effects/ego-death

Josie is hypocritical here: in every other sentence, Josie employs the term “ego death” but here complains that the word is underdefined, so discards it in the chart, yet continues to centrally, heavily employ the term.

I distinguish 2 senses:

beginners’ suspension/dissolution

advanced active cancellation; cybernetic control violation per Eadwine’s {blade} -cm

02:54 – Absent Selfhood

03:57 – Fractured selfhood

04:41 – Unity and interconnectedness

beginners’ sensation of unity, but unearned, and {impure} and impious {pollution}, because unstable use of the possibilism mental model.

versus the advanced kind of unity after repudiating relying on naive possibilism-thinking.

05:33 – Perception of eternalism

7:27 – Existential culmination

8:08 – Perception of synchronicity 👎

08:59 – Existential reaffirmation

10:40 – Perception of death

11:44 – Perception of rebirth

14:00 – Reduced fear of death

14:55 – Perception of interdependent opposites

16:09 – Perception of causal determinism 👎

With Kafei, I object to causal-chain determinism, as experienced or pictured per the way of thinking in the possibilism model in the ordinary state: as a semi-open future that doesn’t exist yet. Domino-chain, in-time determinism. One thing state at one point in time causes the next. -cm

18:29 – Perception of sacredness 👎

not my conceptual vocabulary lexicon.

experiencing something as religious? If cybernetics transgression and comprehension and reset equals religious experience. -cm

19:43 – Reverence

20:30 – Perception of divine presence

21:25 – Existential dread

22:40 – Spirituality enhancement

27:11 – Perceived exposure to inner mechanics of consciousness 👍

28:42 – Perceived exposure to semantic concept network

31:12 – Perception of telepathy 👎

32:52 – Ineffability 👎

Rank newbie beginners can’t use words – proves nothing. -cm

36:46 – Transpersonal hallucinations

37:59 – Noetic insight

40:02 – Noetic truth

40:32 – Noetic realism

41:29 – Platonic conceptualisation

42:34 – Unfathomable beauty

44:24 – Perception of self as designer

46:58 – Perception of self as illusion

I’m against the popular usage of the idea of illusion, or “x is just an illusion”.

I only discuss “illusion” in a technical mechanism analysis perspective.

Egoic possibilism-thinking “is just an illusion”, a cloak, a layer of veiling the underlying mechanism.

That’s as unhelpful as saying that the graphical user interface on a computer “is just an illusion” “but at the lower level machine language is the reality”.

We need a Douglas Hofstadter levels analysis here.

You might as well say that “Everything is an illusion – and there, now I have explained everything”.

That is completely unhelpful of an analysis.

I don’t attach a dismissive value to “illusion”, it is the same as newton’s theory of optics: there is a virtual image, it’s not good, it’s not bad,

The thing, the referent that’s represented by mental constructs exists in some way.

The lazy evasion is to just dismiss something as “just an illusion”. That explains exactly nothing.

What the hard adult work requires is to explain: in what way does something exist, and in what way does it not exist?

I wrote that in my 1997 theory summary outline.

Referents of mental constructs exist, even if they exist in a different way than we initially experience, so I would not simply label a referent of a mental construct “an illusion”.

Any moron can go around labeling everything as “illusion”, this is unhelpful, it does not represent how representation works.

47:54 – Perception of transcension

48:45 – Perception of enlightenment 👍

List of words is a matter of definitions; the disputes are a matter of definition.

I treat the word ‘enlightenment’ exactly identically to how I treat ‘satori, ‘revelation’, ‘completion’, ‘purification’, ‘cleansing’, ‘transformation’, and 10 other words.

People are way too precious about the word, as if magical, ‘enlightened’.

There is nothing special in such a way about being enlightened: every mystery-religion initiate was immortal, completed, adult, mature, having the expected ordinary state of being enlightened.

Stop putting satori artificially elevated on a deliberately out-of-reach pedestal.

Against everyone else in the world, I disagree that if someone says “I am enlightened” that means they are not enlightened.

Only an unenlightened person who falsely thinks that enlightenment is something difficult and rare and impossible to attain would assert that nobody is allowed to be enlightened and nobody is allowed to state the fact of their state of knowledge.

Anyone who acts this way is falsely conflating this confused notion of “shrinking the size of your ego”.

They think that that has something to do with being enlightened.

The person making the accusation simply indicates that they themselves don’t have enlightenment.

It is wrong for them to declare that nobody else is enlightened.

They themselves think in terms of social realm.

It is reductionism, reducing metaphysical knowledge to the social realm of claiming to be better socially than other people in the social realm.

This is the realm of “you are supposed to shrink the size of your ego in relation to the size of other people’s ego”.

That is nonsensical and reductionist.

That view reduces Psilocybin Eternalism to something it’s not, the domain of Social Relations.

From the Egodeath theory point of view and value system, Transcendent Knowledge is not in the domain of social relations.

Only someone who’s completely trapped within the low level of the social realm would accuse other people of being motivated by the social realm.

Like Hatsis saying “Your view is because Allegro…” merely reveals that HIS thinking is stuck in a little orbit limited by Allegro.

A statement of description, that’s all; it’s merely a descriptor term:

Have you incorporated relying on no-free-will in the altered state, to form eternalism-thinking?

Notice how all of the other theorists, they tell you that you are not allowed to be enlightened, and they tell you that you are not allowed to state that you were enlightened, only I allow you and permit you to say, I permit you to be enlightened and I permit you to say that you’re enlightened or that you have satori or that you are perfected through mystical rebirth.

The Egodeath theory, being expressed in the form of Science, provides enlightenment, satori, gnosis, and purification, immediately and straightforwardly, to everyone.

With the Egodeath theory in hand, there is no shortage of enlightenment.

I am not very satisfied with my 1997 Core theory as a sufficient criteria For Enlightenment.

For people who have Transcendent Knowledge to be appropriately literate, I want them to recognize religious myth as description of enlightenment; realization of the eternalism mental world model, added to the possibilism model.

Notice the conflict of interest: the bunk fraudulent meditation gurus tell you that nobody is enlightened, because if anybody achieved enlightenment, then that fake fraudster guru would be out of business; they cannot permit completion and success.

When the coin in the coffer rings, the soul from purgatory springs – or at least becomes 10% smaller in its impurity.

Other theories make your ego 10% smaller each session. Lifetime payments; incremental ego shrinkage on a never-ending installment plan.

The Egodeath theory makes your ego cancel out to zero.

The world’s tiniest theory of Ego Transcendence and Transcendent Knowledge is the Egodeath theory: it is the smallest, and has the biggest explanatory power, and only this theory grants you permission to be enlightened.

Every other theory (and they are all wrong of course) tells you that you are not allowed to be enlightened, there’s no way that you’re enlightened.

Fake, failed theories say that cannot be, that people readily can be enlightened and have satori and completion of mystical rebirth.

These bunk fake impostor theories, they talk about how you need to “reduce the size of your ego” – and in so framing Transcendent Knowledge, they actually reify that which they claim to diminish.

Mystically speaking, are you a child, or are you an adult?

If you are an adult, that’s the same thing as saying you’re enlightened.

Are you an immortal, non-dying?

Have you passed through the dragon-guarded garden gate to eat of the fruit of immortality – shedding your child-thinking at the gate?

Then you’re enlightened; then you have satori; then you have purification; you have advanced mystical unity or true unity.

Why are you frightened?

I am enlightened 😱

Psychedelic Grunge song