Davidson follows in the muddy footsteps of Wouter Hanegraaff, who is incapable of placing the fixed stars in sphere 7 or sphere 8 (as he wrote in footnote 114), so omits them from his cosmos model <shrug>.
Contents:
- Strategy: Quote Wouter Hanegraaff’s Confusions/ Contradictions about Which Sphere Number Is Fate, then Same for Davidson, then Show It’s Same Type of Confusion
- Motivation for this Page
- YouTube Video Link and Info
- Transcript
- Chapters
- Confirmed Davidson Contradicts
- See Also
Strategy: Quote Wouter Hanegraaff’s Confusions/ Contradictions about Which Sphere Number Is Fate, then Same for Davidson, then Show It’s Same Type of Confusion
Motivation for this Page
I snagged entire insane vid transcript of a Wouter Hanegraaff follower who likewise can’t count to 8, cannot say the number of the sphere that contains fixed stars.
This page is for me to pick out the 3 incoherent statements re: fate, fixed stars, rising above Saturn[sic] puts you above fate. fixed stars = Fate.
Where put fixed stars? CRICKETS.
Disaster quote footnote from Wouter Hanegraaff
“i can’t figure out where fixed stars go – not Saturn sphere 7, and they certainly can’t be in our precious fate-free sphere 8 Ogdoad, which is same thing as sphere 9 Ennead, so i give up.”
See idea development page 26 about this.
https://egodeaththeory.org/2025/03/13/idea-development-page-26/#Incoming-Ideas
I’m dumping this big transcript here (not in idea development 26) in this new page for analysis, to email Wouter Hanegraaff & this author to answer Wouter Hanegraaff’s question on p. 294 footnote 114 of the book Hermetic Spirituality and the Historical Imagination: Altered States of Knowledge in Late Antiquity, by Wouter Hanegraaff, 2022.
Paul Davidson & Wouter Hanegraaff Can’t Count to 8, Contradict Which Sphere # Contains Fixed Stars
currently section is dup’d in idea development 26 & the present new vid page
Who contradicts themselves in this way:
- Wouter Hanegraaff
- Paul Davidson — YouTube vid “What is Hermeticism? – ch: ReligionForBreakfast, written by Paul Davidson.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COYJi9CKrGI
PD has no website. I am looking at Paul Davidson site instaad to see if I can copy transcript from there instead of finishing format it myself.
search web Paul Davidson hermeticism
https://www.google.com/search?q=Paul+Davidson+hermeticism
This might be his channel: “Over at his YouTube channel The Inquisitive Bible Reader, Paul Davidson …”
is this him? https://isthatinthebible.wordpress.com/about/ – another sketchy WordPress site, so avoid looking at, can’t be any good.
Search web for “a gigantic body of ancient texts known as the hermetica” from the transcript
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22a+gigantic+body+of+ancient+texts+known+as+the+hermetica%22 – not found. So I posted my copy of transcript here.
YouTube Video Link and Info
YouTube vid:
“What is Hermeticism?
ch: ReligionForBreakfast
Paul Davidson, writer of the episode
Sep. 20, 2024
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COYJi9CKrGI
“Special thanks to the writer of this episode Paul Davidson.
his blog “Is that in the Bible?”:
https://isthatinthebible.wordpress.com
What kind of low-credibility hack uses WordPress?
I miss my underlying url https://EgodeathTheory.WordPress.com
I am going to email Wouter Hanegraaff & Paul Davidson and point out INCOHERENT SELF-CONTRADICTION:
If you rise above Fate as soon as you rise above Planet 7 Saturn & reach sphere 8 = Ogdoad, and the fixed stars = Fate, then what level # contains fixed stars, which are Fate?
It can’t be sphere 7, b/c moving planet level 7 is Saturn, which is Fate.
It can’t be sphere 8, b/c that (the Ogdoad) is above Fate according to you [wrongly], but the fixed stars = Fate, according to you [correctly].
What have you done w fixed stars (Fate)?
What sphere # do you put the fixed stars in?
The correct answer every schoolchild before 1600 knows: fixed stars are level 8, Fate, Ogdoad.
What is the lowest sphere that’s above Fate? You say 8, incoherently & incorrectly. The answer is 9, Ennead.
You write as if Ogdoad and Ennead are both above Fate, with no real difference between them.
YOU ARE CONFUSED and unable to count to 8.
Ogdoad = Fate = 8th sphere = — the THE PICTURES IN YOUR OWN VIDEO PLAINLY SHOW THIS!! CAN YOU NOT COUNT TO 8?!!
ie sphere 8 (Ogdoad) contains zodiac = fixed stars = constellations = Fate.
This is ULTRA elementary, so much, your diagrams plainly show this.
Point in your diagram, point to zodiac sphere, tell me what # is that? Obviously and plainly, sphere 8.
WTF do you think the word “Ogdoad” means? 8th sphere.
Davidson eventually clearly states that, one time, only (fixed stars = sphere 8 = Fate); yet, like Wouter Hanegraaff, he keeps saying “above Saturn = above Fate“, directly contradicting himself, silently, INFINITELY CONFUSING, without him acknowledging & addressing his direct self-contradiction.
The purpose of this page is to gather the three directly self-contradictory statement sentences from the video.
- Above Saturn (sphere 7) = above Fate.
- Fixed stars = Fate.
- Ogdoad (sphere 8) = above Fate.
then where the f are the fixed stars, all of a sudden? DOES NOT COHERE! 🌌💥
How to Build a Universe That Doesn’t Fall Apart Two Days Later
Philip K. Dick, 1978
https://hex.ooo/library/how_to_build.html
How in the hell do you keep saying “rise above Saturn sphere 7 to rise higher than fate“?
But where are the fixed stars? Higher than Saturn!
How are you so plainly inconsistent?
WHAT’S WRONG WITH YOU THAT YOU NEVER JOIN THE TWO FACTS:
- FIXED STARS = FATE
- FIXED STARS = SPHERE 8
- THEREFORE SPHERE 8 = FATE. <– YOU ARE INCAPABLE OF SAYING THIS. YOUR SYSTEM IS BROKEN!
Explanation for the psychological insanity:
You are trying to “protect” level 8 Ogdoad from being Fate.
In fact rising above Saturn (fate) puts you still in Fate (the sphere of the fixed stars).
Reaching sphere 8 does NOT put you above Fate, which you keep falsely, incoherently saying.
ONLY sphere 9 (or higher) is above Fate.
Level 8 is NOT above Fate.
Wouter Hanegraaff’s footnote 114 “I can’t figure out if fixed stars go in Saturn sphere 7 or Ogdoad sphere 8”:
“Whether the fixed stars should be included [with Saturn] or should rather be associated with the Ogdoad remains an open question for me.”
“Bibliography:
Christian Bull, “The Tradition of Hermes Trismegistus,” 2014. [quoted very heavily by Wouter Hanegraaff i finally mem’d title, 4 parts:
Hermetic Spirituality and the Historical Imagination: Altered States of Knowledge in Late Antiquity, 2022]
M. David Litwa, “Hermetica II: The Excerpts of Stobaeus,” 2018.
Wouter Hanegraaff, “Dictionary of Gnosis and Western Esotericism,” 2006.
Video Info in the Description
Video: What is Hermeticism?
297,189 views Sep 20, 2024
YouTube channel: ReligionForBreakfast
959K subscribers
Bibliography:
* Christian Bull, “The Tradition of Hermes Trismegistus,” 2014.
* M. David Litwa, “Hermetica II: The Excerpts of Stobaeus,” 2018.
* Wouter Hanegraaff, “Dictionary of Gnosis and Western Esotericism,” 2006.
Chapters
00:00 Intro
1:39 Hermetica explained
6:01 Hermetic and Platonic Cosmogony
10:09 Fate and the Hermetic Human Condition
12:08 Ascension, the Way of Hermes, and Rebirth
19:30 Was Hermetism a Religion?
24:48 I included a bonus section about baboons in the Nebula version of this vid
Transcript
Writer: Paul Davidson.
From YouTube, formatting & commentary by Michael Hoffman, Egodeath.com.
Intro
Early Christian writers weren’t exactly looking to Pagan philosophers for advice on theology.
In fact they were more focused on debunking the traditional Greco Roman religions.
But Hermes trismagistus stands out as a rare exception
a mythological philosopher viewed by many as the ultimate sage and viewed by some Christians as a non-Christian philosopher who somehow stumbled upon true Christian theology centuries before the arrival of Christ
a fourth century Christian author named lactantius argued that Hermes recognized the Oneness of God, affirmed the notion that humans were made in the image of God, and even believed that God had a son.
Lactantius wrote that Hermes said everything about God the father and much about the son which is contained in the divine secrets.
So what did Hermes trismegistus teach that he even impressed otherwise harsh critics of Greco Roman religion?
Today we’re examining hermeticism or what Scholars Now call hermetism, an esoteric religious and philosophical system that wove together Greek philosophy, Egyptian religion, Greco Roman mystery religion, Judaism, Alchemy, and astrology.
Hermetic philosophy went on to influence scholars in the Islamic world and hermetic texts were eventually rediscovered by Europeans during the Renaissance and were translated into Latin, making them available to new generations of European scientists philosophers and theologians.
Much of modern Western esotericism is indebted to the ideas preserved in these ancient texts.
Now Scholars use the term hermeticism to refer to this later reception and reinterpretation of hermetic texts from the Renaissance onward, and they use the term hermetism to refer to the ancient tradition.
And today we’ll be focusing on the latter so what is hermetism and what are its Core Concepts and principles.
Hermetica explained
Most of what we know about hermetism comes from a gigantic body of ancient texts known as the hermetica.
These are texts attributed to the aforementioned Hermes trismegistus which means Hermes the Thrice greatest.
That’s like really really really great.
[3 really’s on the Max Freakout Really scale; really really really intense loose cognition/ high dose]
Hermes trismegistus was not a historical person but a mythological combo of the Egyptian god th
and his Greek equivalent Hermes th was the god of scribes wisdom astronomy and Magic
he was associated with the Ibis and the baboon and is frequently depicted as an ibis-headed man in Egyptian art
in Greek religion Hermes was the Emissary of the Gods and one who could guide souls in the afterlife
as far back as the Greek historian Herodotus in the 5th Century bcee the Egyptian god th was identified with the Greek Hermes
and during the helenistic period some intellectuals believed that the gods had originally been humans who lived in ancient times
and Hermes trismegistus received the same treat
in many hermetic texts he appears as a human
and by the first century CE Hermes trismegistus was recognized as the quintessential philosopher magician and divine Sage of the distant past
in reality all of the texts of the hertica are pseudonymous
the scholar Christian Bull [intensely cited by Wouter Hanegraaff] theorizes they were composed by heniz Egyptian priests
the Roman geographer strabo for example mentions Egyptian priests living in Thebes educated in philosophy and astronomy who attribute to Hermes all wisdom of this particular kind
but whoever wrote These text texts they really knew their philosophy
hermetic texts show influence especially from middle platonism but also from stoicism and neop Pythagorean thought as well as Jewish thought in some cases
the oldest text in the hermetica May date as far back as the 2 or 3rd Century bcee though some of the more famous philosophical texts date from the 1st to 3rd Century CE
and there were a lot of hermetic texts ancient people threw around what were probably wild exaggerations
the philosopher yamus for example shares a report that there were 20,000 books attributed to Hermes the Egyptian priest
Mano claims over 36,000
exaggeration or not, there were many many texts attributed to Hermes trismegistus or one of his disciples
and most of them are lost to us
so our picture of hermetism is incomplete
and these books cover a huge array of topics
now Scholars of the years have categorized the hermetica into technical texts and religio philosophical texts
the technical books cover topics like astrology, the power of gemstones and plants Alchemy and Magic
the philosophical ones discuss the structure and origins of the cosmos, the nature of human beings, the properties of God, and how to ascend after death
as with many scholarly categories though these are modern labels that wouldn’t have made sense to the ancient people writing and reading these texts
you can find ritual techniques in the philosophical books, and you can find philosophy in the technical books
so don’t think of these as Stark hard and fast categories
one characteristic that the Hermetic philosophical books do share is that they’re not presented in a way that a modern reader might expect
so what’s so different about them
oh hi [alter ego at the vid cam, troublemaker pushing back]
well uh they’re usually written as interactive dialogues between two characters usually Hermes trismegistus and one of his disciples like Isis esus or his son tot
[troublemaker cameraman:]
oh so like a Socratic dialogue
[presenter:]
well not exactly, both Socratic dialogues and hermetic dialogues use the conversational format but the tone and aim between the two genres is very different
so in Socratic dialogues the tone is investigative and critical; sometimes it’s even light-hearted with Socrates engaging in back and forth
uh back and forth exchanges with his companions to get them to uncover contradiction and to push them to deeper understanding of a particular concept
while in hermetic dialogues the tone is much moreac and mystical
Hermes trismegistus is just imparting Divine wisdom to a passive student who’s just asking questions without much push back
got it
[troublemaker:]
I’m going to need a citation for that
[presenter:]
Okay, fine. Sources is in the description below, as usual.
The most famous philosophical texts are found in a compilation called the Corpus hermeticum 17 treatises that were compiled into one text centuries later sometime during the Byzantine period.
So while these are among the most well-known hermetic texts, they should not be considered a hermetic Canon of authoritative texts, like what the New Testament is for Christianity.
Other compilations include some texts found among the nonami Cotes
and there’s also 40 excerpts in an anthology by the fifth century author Yan stas
Hermetic and Platonic Cosmogony
with so many texts and many of them fragmentary it’s impossible to identify a consistent systematic hermetic theology, but we can identify some key themes shared across these texts
And a good place to begin is the Hermetic understanding of cosmogeny the origins of the cosmos
this is primarily laid out in a text called pandre
This is a dialogue between a being named pandr and Hermes trismegistus
pandre is the teacher in this case and seems to be a reference to God himself
according to this text the essence of God is mind or Nous
creation begins with God or I guess I should say the first mind speaking into existence his son the logos together with the second mind aka the Craftsman or demiurge.
The logos descends into nature to become the four elements, while the demiurge creates seven Heavenly rulers the seven classical planets the Moon Sun Mercury Venus Mars Jupiter and Saturn
[moon mer ven sun mar jup sat -> fixed stars -> precession]
[he groups: moon sun; vs. 5 planet-stars: mer ven mar jup sat]
These in turn set creation in motion producing animals and other living things from the elements
this cosmogeny is largely inspired by platonic philosophy
in Plato’s tus Plato shares an elaborate Cosmic model that formed the basis for how philosophers understood cosmogeny for the next few centuries
Plato described the cosmos as a great sphere with Earth at its Center
the stars and the Seven classical planets revolve around the Earth in their own concentric spheres
the planets were regarded as deities and the cosmos itself was filled with souls and other intermediary spirits
[demiurge = ruler of planet rulers = fixed stars, all-important sphere around which other levels are in relation to.]
Everything was composed of four primal elements earth air fire and water
and the world was created not by the Supreme God who existed beyond the cosmos but by a second Divine being called the Craftsman or demiurge
furthermore the creation of the world [cosmic 4D rock] requ required the uniting of two opposing forces necessity [~eternalism] or Ananke which brings about activity and disorder and intellect or Nous which subjugates necessity to order and [high, post-Psilocybin] reason.
Most Greco Roman philosophical systems including middle platonism, stoicism Gnostic Christianity and hermetism were based on this framework.
[you DISHONOR MITHRAS – David Ulansey’s solution explaining Mithraism]
But each had its own spin on it
hermetic texts like the PO mandre share a very lofty Transcendent view of God whom they called the father.
as the scholar David Litwa puts it, the Hermetic God is a supreme ineffable being who transcends language bodies and all perceptible reality
in a writing called Hermes to esus Hermes tells his pupil God is not mind but he is the cause of mind’s being;
he is not Spirit but the cause of spirit’s being;
and he is not light but the cause of light’s being.
Now we don’t always find agreement in the exact specifics of the Hermetic view of God but it’s clear that the Hermetic God is one is supreme and is utterly transcendent.
pandre also describes a demiurge or Craftsman which might sound familiar if you’ve seen my videos on gnosticism or valentinian Christianity. [linked above]
Several ancient groups around this time believed in a lower Creator God who crafted the material world.
[heimarmene; he dwells in level 8 Ogdoad fixed stars]
But while the demiurge in these other Traditions is either ignorant or even malicious, the Demi orent in hermetism is closer to Plato’s idea of the Craftsman.
he’s not necessarily a bad guy he’s just second to the ultimate God
in this case a second Nous or mind
hermetism also shares a very LOF y view of humanity in pandre the supreme god creates a primordial androgynous human
the text says Nous the father of all who is life and light gave birth to a man like himself whom he loved as his own child
this human is described as having the image of God
and here we see some influence from The Book of Genesis
this androgynous primordial human is allowed to join in the demiurge’s work creating the material world, what the text calls nature [heimarmene; eternalism]
When this human sees their own reflection in water the human desires to inhabit nature causing the Primal human and nature to embrace.
And the text implies sexually because this Embrace produces a being that is uniquely comprised of a mortal body and an immortal Soul.
PO mandre says for this reason of all living beings on Earth man alone is two-fold Mortal because of the body Immortal because of the real man real man in the sense of an essential human our true self
later all living things including the human are split into male and female
female so they can multiply
Fate and the Hermetic Human Condition
However, humans retain this dual nature, an immortal Essence that is divine and a mortal body that is tied to the world and controlled by Fate — capital F Fate.
In hermetism, Fate could be described as a cosmic force or external energy that governs the world and imposes action on it.
And it was closely related to the movement of the stars and planets.
[why then do you keep omitting stars from Ogdoad and falsely saying Ogdoad is above Fate? (as often as not) saying that to go above Saturn is to go above Fate – then what about fixed stars, which you sometimes said is fate? no cohere]
One hermetic text says the Stars serve fate.
One can neither Escape fate nor protect oneself from the powerful imp influence of the Stars.
[beware: Wouter Hanegraaff is horribly misleading here: when HE says “stars”, he deceptively means the planetary wandering “stars”, b/c Hanegraaff can’t decide where to place fixed stars, ie, he thinks 7 won’t work (true) and he thinks 8 won’t work (false; confused) b/c he treats sphere 8 as if = glorious freewill, purified of awful eternalism – backwards!]
[soul can’t; spirit, only, can escape eternalism / heimarmene/ Fate/ “the world”/ “nature” etc]
The stars are the instrument of Fate.
By Fate’s decree all things reach their intended end in nature.
And among human beings fate was also administered by the decans, the Egyptian zodiac. [fixed stars]
These were 36 constellations [fixed stars] that were important for tracking the calendar.
And they had astrological significance as well.
They were conceptualized as Egyptian astral [fixed stars] deities who controlled 10 days each for a total of 360 days.
[stars AS WELL AS planets:]
herst Hermeticists believed that the decans together with the seven planets could cause major events like famines droughts and earthquakes.
But fate really only controls our bodies [soul] and the world of matter not our true essential self [spirit].
The Divine part of humanity can break free from fate.
[transcend eternalism; we can wash clean our freewill thinking, to use the illusion-premised personal control system, yet also be righteous and fully rational]
Another hermetic text reads we have the power to choose: to choose the better is up to us.
[who is this ‘us’? the egoic personal control system, now washed clean and JUSTIFIED]
Choosing when dictated by vices draws near to bodily nature since all intelligent reason in us has free choice, Fate does not control it [high Reason].
So this dual Divine material nature means that the Mundane world can distract us or turn us away from the correct path.
And some hermetic texts describe this Human Condition somewhat pessimistically
pandre reads he who loves the body which is born from the error of Desire remains wandering in the dark and sensibly suffers the effects of death.
But other texts describe it more optimistically.
Humanity’s dual material and divine nature means that humans occupy an honored middle position between the gods and material things.
The Hermetic text called Aesclipus reads wondering at Heavenly beings and worshipping them tending Earthly beings and governing them.
So Humanity stands between the Earthly and divine.
Ascension, the Way of Hermes, and Rebirth
but regardless of how the human condition is framed hermetic texts share a deep concern with ascending and reuniting with the supreme god
in a dramatic scene in pandre the soul after death ascends through the seven heavens
[WHAT THE HELL ABOUT THE 8TH HEAVEN, FIXED STARS – THERE YOU GO AGAIN, FORGETTING AND SWEEPING UNDER THE RUG – CAN YOU NOT COUNT, CONSISTENTLY, TO 8??]
and merges with the first mind
this is the final good for those who have received knowledge to be made God with the Mortal body Left Behind one
must Ascend to the highest realms the eighth and Ninth spheres
[there you go again conflating 8th & 9th spheres, which are: pure Fate, vs. transcend Fate]
Why the eighth and Ninth?
Well remember that the seven planetary spheres govern the material world through fate.
[PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE MISSING FIXED STARS ALL OF A SUDDEN – Hanegraaff i see you wrote this, not Davidson]
So you need to ascend above them [spheres 1-7, only??!!] in order to be beyond the influence of Fate where your essential human can reunite with the Divine.
These Realms are called the Ogdoad [pure eternalism] and Ennead [transcend eternalism] respectively.
The Ogdoad means the eight-fold. [pure eternalism]
In its original meaning it refers to the eight primordial deities of Egyptian religion.
[his word ‘original’ might (but i doubt) hint that he’s waffling between two different systems: highest fate-level is 7 Saturn, vs. later, the highest fate-level is 8 fixed stars – but he needs to be WAY clearer, if that’s what he’s doing]
In the Hermetic system though these become the Eight Powers that make up the realm of the demiurge.
[demiurge = heimarmene = 7 planet spheres + sphere 8 of fixed stars]
This realm is the eighth sphere of the Cosmos located just beyond the seven planets.
[Correct, SO HOW COME YOU KEEP SAYING “ASCEND ABOVE SATURN/ABOVE FATE?? instead of properly saying “ascend above Saturn to attain pure fate” and then after that, “ascend above fixed stars/ above fate“?]
The Ennead on the other hand means the ninefold. [transcend eternalism]
And it’s an even higher realm of existence, in Egyptian mythology referred to the nine great deities worshiped at heliopolis: Atum Shu te n GB n Osiris Isis set and nephus.
[Do the author & Hanegraaff claim to be discussing two different cosmos models, where in the simpler earlier model, the upper Fate sphere is Saturn, so that (in that model) the sphere of the fixed stars = above Fate?? and the later model is mine, where Saturn & fixed stars are Fate, then above fixed stars – in Ennead – is above Fate?? They need to be WAY clearer about this flip-flop, if that’s what they intend.]
In hermic cosmology, the Ennead becomes the ninth sphere of the cosmos where the self- begotten Nous dwells and it’s the destination of the most righteous Souls [no, spirit – soul is stuck at 8 Ogdoad, max] after [psychedelic ego] death.
So how do you ascend up into the 8th and 9th?
[CONFLATION OF SPHERE 8 & 9! FOLLOWING HANE, HE THINKS BOTH ARE ABOVE FATE WHICH IS SATURN BUT WHERE THEN FIXED STARS? Can we say the author here is somewhat inconsistent? If I mark up all the key assertions, yes.]
Well various texts provide instructions on how to achieve this Ascension.
Scholars call these instructions the way of Hermes.
Though as we’ll discuss in the next section we should be careful about framing this way of Hermes as a distinct religious community
A lot of hermetic texts could be classified as initiatory
But it’s not really an initiation into a distinct cult like the cult of Isis or the cult of mithis.
Hermetism probably wasn’t that well organized.
We can call them initiatory in the sense that these texts serve the purpose of guiding a reader or a disciple through a transformative mystical journey of deeper and deeper knowledge.
[reaching the Egodeath theory: Transcendent Knowledge; psychedelic eternalism, aided by CLARIFYING (not confusing, like Hanegraaff & his dubious hermeticists) analogy; {myth} & {motifs} to help explain Transcendent Knowledge; transformation from possibilism to eternalism, per def’n of the word ‘analogy’]
This path to deathlessness [means maturity, no longer immature ego death reminder; a-thanatos] or salvation [rescue from control instability & heimarmene] is not for everyone but only for an elect few [who are predestined, ie, pre-existing w/ enlightenment].
In fact some hermetic texts describe something like the belief in the transmigration of the Soul as in after death one soul is usually reborn into another body
The Souls of the just are reborn as kings philosophers and esteemed intellectuals.
The Souls of the wicked though are reborn in the bodies of animals
One text reads yet if you are workers of Greater sins you will not advance from the molded [mortal] body.
When your due service is paid you will not dwell in Heaven nor even in human bodies.
You will complete the rest of your lives wandering the bodies of non- reasoning beasts.
[like Phil. dept. psychedelic philosopher Chris Letheby, or Thomas Hatsis “the shape of the liberty cap is anachronistic”]
Only the most righteous will Ascend after [ego] death which might take many lifetimes. [Psilocybin sessions]
Another text reads:
Do you see how many bodies we must pass through my son? How many troops of demons
[guard the heimarmene Psilocybin transformation gate]
cosmic connections and Stellar circuits in order to hasten toward the one and only.
But for the initiates who are worthy and righteous [washed clean your the egoic personal control system, while always using freewill thinking, now qualified] enough to attain it.
This means breaking free from fate,
[going above sphere 8 fixed stars = spirit is free from fate]
learning the secrets needed to pass beyond the planetary [sic! YOU FORGOT — AGAIN — THE FIXED STARS!] spheres.
[does “the planetary spheres” magically somehow include sphere 8, fixed stars??
i smell Hanegraaff’s fingerprints all over this copypaste confusion job]
[you DO pass above planet sphere 7, to EVENTUALLY reach above Fate, but not yet. first, above 7, you reach pure Fate – fixed stars – home of the demiurge — and THEN you move not above planets, but rather, above fixed stars sphere, to FINALLY reach 9, above Fate
its not that hard, ppl 🤨 ]
[secret to pass = password/ toll for the guarded gate]
The starting point appears to be Gnosis or knowledge, particularly knowledge of the self.
[personal control system]
People need to obtain true intimate knowledge of their True Divine Nature.
[inside the mind is hidden source of control thoughts – seeing that, during Psilocybin peak window = Transcendent Knowledge & ego death of king ego]
We saw this in that quote from pandre which describes merging with the supreme god after [ego] death
[beware of beginners’ Unity (false/ premature) model of Transcendent Knowledge]
The final good for those who have received knowledge
[is Rev 22:14 – pass through gate, eat tree of life 13 fruits]
The initiate must be taught that they are an immortal [a-thantos, no longer subject to ego death seizure instability] being with the potential to ascend [ability to endure the Psilocybin state] through the Heavenly spheres [DO YOU MEAN 1-7, OR 1-8 – WHICH WOULD INCL FIXED STARS, WHICH IS FATE] and reunite with their true Source.
[the hidden, uncontrollable source of control-thoughts: that is what’s important, much more so than pop beginners dabblers shallow “Unity” theory]
In book four of the Corpus hermeticum Hermes tells his son knowledge is not a beginning of the good, but it furnishes us with the beginning of the good that will be known.
“So let us seize this beginning and travel with all speed, for the path is very crooked that leaves familiar things of the present to return to primordial things of old.”
Now in pandre this ascent and merging with God is something that happens to you after you [ego-] die.
But other writings interpreted this as an ecstatic experience which could happen to every hermetist in this life.
[AS IF the first sentence didn’t mean the same damn thing!!]
Dr David Litwin describes it as a rebirth into higher Divine Consciousness.
And several hermetic texts seem to describe rituals [of ingesting Psilocybin] where an initiate could experience a rebirth and activate their higher Consciousness.
One of the best examples is book 13 of the Corpus hermeticum where hermes’s son tot undergoes a ritual of [ingesting, then] rebirth.
The text begins with tot asking Hermes to teach him the way:
“I am ready now and my mind is set firmly away from the beguilement of the world.
Fulfill your promise to me in which you said you would set before me the way in which rebirth is bestowed.”
Hermes responds by explaining that rebirth requires that tot cleanse himself of the the irrational torments of matter.
[“matter” = Fate; also, pollution = possibilism-thinking that causes control instability]
These torments of matter are a list of vices or sins like Injustice, lust, greed and envy.
But Chief among them [vices/sins] is ignorance.
[of the Egodeath theoryTM at Egodeath.com: you gotta believe in eternalism, ie, you are experientially revealed to be a helpless puppet frozen in rock, enslaved, isn’t my theory awesome?!]
Next, tot must observe a period of ritual silence before Hermes announces that TT is being purified by God and is being filled with divine power, most notably, knowledge.
After all, you need knowledge to get rid of that ignorance.
[naive freewill thinking; naive possibilism-thinking: thinking you – the egoic personal control system – are source of your thoughts, as if they aren’t frozen in 4D block eternalism]
Henceforth my child Rejoice the powers of God purify you.
[reveal illusory status of autonomous control & possibility-branching w/ egoic steering-power]
A new to us has come knowledge of God and when it comes my child ignorance has been expelled.
So now that tot has been filled with these Divine Powers.
Hermes then teaches tot how to perform the hymn of rebirth.
An Earthly version of a cosmic song.
And the text actually goes into a lot of detail about how to perform it:
“And so my son standing in an open space and facing south at The Descent of the Setting Sun kneel down in prayer;
and likewise face East at Sunrise.”
And here’s why I said you can sometimes find ritual techniques in the philosophical books:
The text has specific instructions on how to perform this hymn.
The Scholar Christian Bull thinks that the hym that follows was actually performed by hermetic groups and may have been drawn from a hermetic hymnal.
It’s even titled “Secret hymn book song number four”, so maybe it was part of a collection.
The hymn itself Praises God as the source of all existence and order in the cosmos:
“Together Let Us Praise Him raised high above the Heaven’s creator of all nature.
Now the hymn lyrics don’t actually look like a typical ancient Greek religious hymn.
In fact a lot of the language looks more like what we see in Greek magical papy from Egypt.
So some Scholars think it was translated from an Egyptian original.
overall
Corpus hermeticum 13 describes a mystical experience that transforms the initiate.
He no longer identifies with his material body [Fate, or, the egoic personal control system] but has emerged with the Nous.
[Nous is probably sphere 9 precession of equinox outside Fate heimarmene fixed stars ogdoad shere 8 like in Mithraism per David Ulansey]
It’s called a rebirth because he essentially is a new human
Scholars describe it almost like an exorcism: you exorcise all of that ignorance, [illusion-based the egoic personal control system] deceit and envy, and replace it with knowledge truth and joy.
And being filled with these Divine Powers the person essentially is now composed of a new immaterial and Immortal body, a body impervious to the vicissitudes of fate.
It also means that when this initiate dies their essential self will automatically be released and returned to its place of origin.
Another text describing an initiate glimpsing the 8th and 9th Realms is called the discourse on the 8th and 9th which was discovered among the nagadi codices.
[8 = reach 100% grasp of eternalism/ fatedness; 9 = sort of transcend eternalism/fate]
The text begins with tot reminding Hermes of his promise to induct him into the Ogdoad [sphere 8, actually heimarmene; fixed stars] and Ennead. [sphere 9, actually this is the lowest sphere that transcends heimarmene]
[REACHING 100% HEIMARMENE FIXED STARS IS A HUGE PROJECT, CHALLENGE, ACCOMPLISHMENT; 99% OF YOUR EFFORT IS TO ACCOMPLISH THIS VICTORY, TO REACH 100% ETERNALISM/ PUPPETHOOD/ ENSLAVEMENT IN ROCK; ie Wouter Hanegraaff has all his values backwards & disproportionate, huge confusion around this. — Michael Hoffman]
“My father, yesterday you promised me that you would bring my mind to the 8th.”
[Make me fully perceive and comprehend fatedness/ heimarmene/ eternalism, and hang onto that POV this time.]
[Hanegraaff thinks 8th = pure from Fate/ eternalism. It’s the exact opposite! purifed of possibilism-thinking/ naive freewill thinking]
[purify thinking, get rid of possibilism-thinking reliance; attain 100% eternalism-thinking; reach full Fate] and afterwards you would bring me into the ninth. [transcend eternalism]
[{purify} = get rid of freewill thinking reliance! Get rid of possibilism; the mental {dirtiness} is not Fate (eternalism); it’s possibilism! Hanegraaff has it entirely backwards, he thinks purify means get rid of eternalism-thinking – {wash robe} actually means attaining eternalism-thinking]
Hermes agrees, and they start singing A Hymn of ascent.
At its climax, the initiate sees the 8th sphere. [100% pure fate, purified of contamination which is naive possibilism-thinking aka egoic freewill thinking, as if monolithic, autonomous control.]
[the climax of the journey is achieving & retaining grasp of eternalism, NOT possibilism or transcending eternalism]
“I see the ogdoad [fixed stars/ heimarmene / eternalism / puppethood enslavement to Fate, sphere 8] and the souls [notice not spirits, that’s 9] that are in it and the angels [now sphere 9] singing hymns to the Ennead and its power,
[Ennead = sphere 9 = precession of equinoxes, above fixed stars zodiac; above {the hard-won amazing ultimate achievement, which is eternalism}]
and I see him who has all their power [at level 10, creator/God] and who creates by means of the spirit.”
[spirit = sphere 9]
In other words, the initiate glimpses what he will see when his body [fate level] dissolves [loose cognition] and
[maybe that means attain fate, or maybe the egoic personal control system; maybe egoic deluded belief in possibilism as foundation]
his soul ascends after [Psilocybin ego] death.
[per Valentinus per Gnostic Gospels / Pagels’ first 3 books, soul usually is lower than spirit. usually soul = fixed stars = heimarmene; only the spirit = transcend heimarmene = 9th sphere, per Mithraism]
From these two text we see that hermetist were deeply concerned with a transformative process of rebirth and the Soul rejoining God after [psychedelic ego] death.
[We don’t mean mere popular Psilocybin dabblers’ beginners’ glimpse of Unity; but rather, post-battle full completion of initiation after the long hard work that’s 99% consists of struggling to REACH & ATTAIN heimarmene – barely any of the journey is re: transcending heimarmene! That last bit of the journey is but a tiny flip from Ogdoad to Ennead, only. Disproportionate Wouter Hanegraaff has the emphasis all backwards, counter to his egoic freewill-worshipping presuppositions. Transcendent Knowledge is MAINLY transformation from possibilism to eternalism, NOT mainly transformation from eternalism to possibilism – latter is minor afterthought at end of main journey, NOT the bulk of the transformation work/journey!]
But both emphasize that you can experience an ecstatic Union [read: typically, beginner glimpse of union unearned, unclean pollution; get kicked out of Heaven by offended god] with the Divine even while alive, which you could achieve through personal [control system] purification and proper ritual.
Was Hermetism a Religion?
Now the fact that these two texts describe specific hymns raises the question:
What did hermetic practice look like?
Scholars have long debated if there were hermetic religious communities.
Like were there people walking around calling themselves hermetist attending hermetic churches and Performing this ritual of rebirth?
To answer this question it’s helpful to consider what we mean by religious community
one might think of a community similar to a Christian Church
in late antique Egypt Christian was a social identity
Christian communities would meet at recognizable buildings called basilicas, led by recognizable religious authorities called priests or monks
they shared a sacred story about the death and resurrection of Jesus, and they shared communal rituals like baptism or the Eucharist [Psilocybin]
This kind of structure provides a clear sense of identity and belonging to its adherents and a clear set of characteristics that help us identify a specific religion that we call Christianity.
On the other hand we can imagine a looser less definable group maybe something like a reading Circle or a philosophical Society groups where individuals are drawn together by a shared interest in certain texts and ideas.
But without formalized doctrines or authoritative leadership scholars in recent years have argued there must have been some sort of hermetic communities though it’s difficult to Envision what they really looked like on the ground scattered throughout hermetic texts are references to communal rituals like a ritual Embrace and formal prayers
A great example is found from another text
from the nagadi codes the so-called prayer of Thanksgiving which appears to be some sort of hermetic lurgical prayer possibly chanted as part of a hermetic Gathering
The prayer starts with an introductory Line “This is the prayer that they spoke”, perhaps alluding to an actual social group, before it launches into a prayer of thanks for the Supreme God:
“We give thanks to you every soul and heart is lifted up to you honored with the name God and praised with the name father”
hermetic ideas permeate the prayer like the idea that humans possess a spark of the Divine and that there’s a connection between the Divine mind and the human mind enabling them to comprehend higher truth
“we Rejoice having been illuminated by your knowledge
we Rejoice because while we were in the body you have made us Divine through your knowledge”
again notice that focus on Gnosis
the prayer ends with a side note that again seems to imply a ritual Gathering of some sort
when they had said these things in the prayer they embraced each other and they went to eat their holy food which has no blood in it
[Psilocybin; fungus, not plant, not meat]
this seems to be a reference to a vegetarian [fungal] sacramental meal which is also mentioned in another hermetic text called Aus
wishing these things we turn to a pure meal [Psilocybin] without flesh of animals
now it might be a stretch to say that this prayer was performed in a lurgical setting like a hermetic Church though maybe we can Envision something like a masonic lodge a fraternity or a philosophical school
we just don’t know
David Litwa envisions something like a philosophical Discussion Group, a loose group of individuals seeking salvation through initiatory readings
Christian Bull argues that wherever and however these rituals were performed these gatherings likely involved Egyptian priesthoods and groups connected somehow to Egyptian temples
in Roman Egypt he speculates we can Envision an Egyptian priest setting up a reading group in the Marketplace or public forum or maybe in the private house of a wealthy individual
ancient texts also mention Egyptian priests living in Temple complexes
like they actually lived there like on a campus
and groups would gather for [Psilocybin] banquets or other gatherings in a room or building on the premises
Dr Bull proposes that hermetism might have originated in groups devoted to various Egyptian gods around the turn of the Common Era as the educated Elite of the Roman Empire traveled to Egypt seeking the ancient wisdom that Egypt was famous for
Egyptian religion became commercialized so to speak Priestly Association dedicated to th Hermes spraying up in cities like hermopolis and Thebes where pilgrims could be instructed by actual Egyptian priests
and these Egyptian priests adopted the language and vocabulary of Greco Roman philosophy combining Egyptian and Greek elements in a way that would have seemed exotically Egyptian to foreigners but accessible to any educated person
so we don’t have evidence that people were walking around calling themselves hermetist like how Christian was a label of self-identity by this time
but it is likely there were voluntary associations of people reading these text texts holding to a hermetic world view of the cosmos and salvation and participating in hermetic rituals like that prayer of Thanksgiving
It’s Tricky though because these texts reflect the opinions of literate experts literate philosophers speculating about the nature of the universe and God
so when you pick up PO Andre are we getting a glimpse into a world viw and ritual life shared by a lot of people or are we just getting a glimpse into the mind of a single literate philosopher?
Overall, hermetism offered what we could call a practical theology an attempt to bridge abstract philosophical ideas with lived practical experience
yes hermetism was rooted in complex theoretical cosmology and ideas about the nature of the Divine, but it also offered concrete practices that initiated followers on a path toward salvation.
For hermetists, salvation is not something you just passively await; it’s actively pursued through a process of alienation from the world [heimarmene], rebirth, and mystical Union with the supreme god.
[Union is overemphasized by the huge mass of beginners; control transformation is under-ack’d]
The belief that humans possess a dual nature part material part divine implies an ethical responsibility to govern one’s body and mind properly.
Hermetic teachings thus encouraged followers to transcend Earthly desires and the distractions of the material world [ie 4D block universe eternalism/ heimarmene] in order to break free from Fate’s control.
In this sense, hermetism provides a pathway not only for understanding the cosmos, but for living a righteous divinely attuned life.
I included a bonus section about baboons in the Nebula version of this vid
So we’re coming up on the 10-year anniversary of religion for breakfast
I published my first video in October 2014 and back then one of my earliest Inspirations was Abigail Thorne over at philosophy tube
she was starting to publish talking head explainer videos about philosophy
I was starting to publish explainer talking head videos about religious studies but while my format has stayed mostly the same over the years she has evolved into publishing these amazing 1hour long deep
dives with elaborate costumes and sketches
and she’s just recently jumped to the next level releasing her first original short film Dracula’s ex-girlfriend
It’s about two former Rivals who share the same toxic ex Count Dracula
now I know a lot of you watching my channel are into esoteric topics and the Occult so trust me there’s definitely some audience crossover appeal here
what better way to kick off spooky season than a film about vampires made by a philosophy content creator
you can watch it exclusively on nebula a streaming service built by and for independent creators where you can watch a ton of amazing content totally adree
and Abigail’s film is a great example of what we’re doing at nebula empowering independent creators to elevate their work giving them the freedom and resources to make better stories with better production value all without the negative incentives of clickbait and Advertiser friendly guidelines that you find on other platforms
you can find original content like archaeology Quest a show featuring two science creators trying to learn how to live in the Stone Age making their own tools and hunting we’ve also started a current events-based show called what to follow USA where the tldr news team guides you through the weekly chaos of American political news nebula Originals like these are the best example of what we do on nebula we’re a group of dedicated creators coming together on our own platform to push ourselves to the next level to get a yearly nebula subscription
/ end of transcript from YouTube formatted by Michael Hoffman Egodeath.com, EgodeathTheory.WordPress.com
Confirmed Davidson Contradicts
April 4, 2025: Confirmed that Hanegraaff and Davidson both silently try to hide and obscure the fact that their negative attitude about fixed stars contradicts their positive attitude about Ogdoad.
They take an obfuscationist, Y-shaped strategy to hide from the gullible(?) reader that their attiudes are incoherent and contradictory.
The reason why Hanegraaff and Davidson confuse the reader and do not simply put the number “sphere 8” throughout their treatment:
were they to put “sphere 8” every time they mention the hated “fixed stars = fate”
or — on their separate arm of discussion — every time they mention the beloved “Ogdoad” (where they sneakily GO SILENT about the fixed stars),
it would become clear to the reader that the same sphere, 8, is incoherently described – in one arm of discussion — as despicably inside the cosmos, or – in the other arm of discussion — as gloriously outside the cosmos.
The solution, for the reader to expose the authors’ efforts to hide their incoherence & pretend it’s the reader’s fault for being confused:
- Every time the author mentions Saturn or the 7 planets or “the planetary cosmos”, write “sphere 7” or “spheres 1-7”.
- Every time the author mentions fixed stars or zodiac or “constellations” or “Ogdoad, write “sphere 8”.
- Every time the author mentions Ennead or Pleroma, write “sphere 9”.
Now it will become clear the author’s contradictory attitudes about sphere 8:
- When Hanegraaff or Davidson talks about sphere 8 re: fixed stars, sphere 8 = bad = Fate.
- When Hanegraaff or Davidson talks about sphere 8 re: Ogdoad, sphere 8 = good = above Fate.
Their cheap magician’s bluff that the author tries to pull over on the audience is: the fixed stars (bad!) are in sphere 8, but transcending Fate (good!) is instead, in a sphere called “Ogdoad”.
This flimsy bluff tries to hide that the Ogdoad is identical w/ sphere 8, and Hanegraaff and Davidson are trying to hide that they have self-contradictory attitudes re the same sphere, “8” (bad! Fate!) aka Ogdoad (good! Above Fate!)
Don’t let Hanegraaff-Davidson bluff and confuse you: the highest level of the cosmos and Fate is not Saturn (sphere 7).
The highest level of the cosmos and Fate is:
- sphere 8.
- Fate; fatedness; heimarmene; Ananke.
- block-universe eternalism; Minkowski 4D spacetime eternalism
- {snake frozen in rock}.
- the cosmic rock.
- enslaved, prison, archon (sphere 1-7) prison guards.
- Ogdoad.
- fixed stars.
- sphere of the fixed stars.
- demiurge.
- Yaldabaoth.
- the soul/ the psyche rises only to this level; no higher.
- the vault of heaven.
- the fixed stars.
- the starry sky.
- the boundary of the cosmos.
The level that’s above Fate is:
- sphere 9
- Ennead
- spirit/pneuma rises to this level.
- nous
- the Pleroma
- precession of the equinoxes.
- above/ outside the cosmos.
- the Aeons.s
- transcend eternalism; transcend heimarmene; transcend Fate.
- outside the Fate-ruled cosmos.
Reiterate the takeaway: to catch the authors trying to hide their two incoherent contradictory story framings and bluffing with their
“stars (Fate) vs. Ogdoad (above Fate)“
incoherent nonsense, always assign the sphere # to the authors’ shifting shell-game terms.
Always translate to sphere # 1-9 (especially 8);
INTERROGATE THE AUTHOR:
WHAT SPHERE NUMBER ARE YOU NOW TALKING ABOUT WITH YOUR EVER-SHIFTING TERMS? DO YOU MEAN SPHERE 8? OR 7 OR 9?
Especially forcefully pin down weasel-word Hanegraaff & Davidson re: sphere 8.
Because DAVIDSON, IF YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT SPHERE 8 WHEN YOU UTTER “OGDOAD” THEN YOU *MUST* MEAN FIXED STARS, SO Say It!!
Say “the fixed stars are here, in the precious Ogdoad”!
You can’t, because you try to hide your incoherent contradiction:
- out of one side of mouth, fixed stars are bad = Fate = the sphere above Saturn.
- out of the other side of mouth, Ogdoad is good = above Fate = above the 7 evil fate-ruled planet spheres. [note the stars go missing suddenly and “sphere 8” goes missing, as sleight-of-hand terminology shifts now to obscurantist “Ogdoad”, hyping and framing Ogdoad AS IF it is above cosmic Fate.]
The audience has to resort to card-counting; forcefully (against the author’s objection) assigning sphere #s, especially re: sphere 8, to prevent Davidson’s attempt to hide his incoherent self-contradiction, simultaneously saying sphere 8 is Fate and is Above Fate.
That’s what I did in Hermetic Spirituality and the Historical Imagination: Altered States of Knowledge in Late Antiquity (Wouter Hanegraaff, 2022).
https://egodeaththeory.org/2022/07/14/hermetic-spirituality-and-the-historical-imagination-altered-states-of-knowledge-in-late-antiquity-hanegraaff/
https://www.amazon.com/Hermetic-Spirituality-Historical-Imagination-Knowledge/dp/1009123068/
~~
Throughout the book, I marked every instance of the above word lists as sphere # 1-9, especially sphere 8, to catch Hanegraaff telling two contradictory, incoherent stories, and strategically going silent about the fixed stars every time his brings up his precious “Fate-free[sic] Ogdoad” fake academic incoherent construct.
Hanegraaff & Davidson keep kicking the fixed stars into the Hanegraaff Rejected wastebasket, try to to hide the fact that his cosmos is a Yaldabaoth monstrous creation malformed abomination self-contradiction guaranteed fury frenzy chaos wrath impurity turmoil.
He lectures on purity and casting out planetary pollution, yet constructs a thoroughly dirty cosmos.
YOU MUST BRING TOGETHER YOUR PRECIOUS WORD “OGDOAD” AND THE FIXED STARS.
Stop pretending they are unrelated and different.
The Ogdoad is defined by the fixed stars.
See Also
My Wouter Hanegraaff pages about his crazy dilemma:
He can’t put fixed stars in sphere 7 or 8.
He conflates/ equates sphere 8 and 9, wasting sphere 8, serving no purpose.
He says going above 7 = going above Fate, which is fixed stars.
todo
The Egodeath theory 