Contents:
- todo
Is it possible to believe the scientific Egodeath theory while being in a valid way a Christian?
I was esoterically saved in the mystic state involving a vision of the crucifixion, and afterward around 1995 was baptised in the church of my literalist grandfather.
Must Christianity be seen as not a European religion, and thus necessarily harmful to Europeans? Even investigating the question is too political to discuss.
Challenge: Having to define a “new” version of Christianity, esoteric, gnostic-like (“evil!”), 2-layer, literalist figurative religion.
Reference the Valentinian Gnostics per Elaine Pagels’ first 3 books: they affirm literalist beliefs for the exoteric Christians, while meaning that literalism in a figurative non-literal way.
____________
A conservative Catholic political leader recently called for allying Protestants, Catholics, and Orthodox. I advocate allying Atheists and Pagans such as Northern European pagans as well.
I realistically consider Catholicism to be a distinctly different religion than New Testament Christianity such as the “non-denominational”, “non-creedal confessional” Stone/Campbell Churches of Christ. See the standard objections of Protestants to the Catholic elements of worship.
______________
I cannot relate to proselytizing people into literalist Christianity. But all of my work on the Egodeath theory can be seen as proselytizing people into esoteric perennial Christianity.
The New Testament’s conduct-of-life moral system including s-xual conduct is “political”. New Testament Christianity can be divided into esoteric wisdom, in support of daily mundane conduct-of-life.
____________
A problem with Perennial Traditionalism is, how can you support a particular religion, if you believe that all religions (at least in their esoteric mystic-state layer) are essentially the same? Mustn’t you reject every religion, when you say all religions are essentially (or at least esoterically) the same?
Challenge: Having to combine identifying with a particular religion, along with affirming perennial wisdom such as Greek Mystery Religion.
If a person who believes the Egodeath theory affirms, say, Greek Mystery Religion, doesn’t this mean that that person disbelieves and rejects Christianity? Then everyone is the loser and no one is permitted by the Egodeath theory to affirm any brand of religion.
How can Christians say that the Greeks such as Plato had wisdom and Reason, when Christianity has exclusive claims to Revelation, revealed knowledge? Must Christians dismiss and denigrate Greek religious philosophy?
The following article discusses the debates about the compatibility of Greek and Christian wisdom, often mischaracterized unhelpfully as “Reason vs. Faith”.
Hidden and Rejected Knowledge: Frithjof Schuon, Perennialism and the Philosophia Perennis
Tim Earney (2014)
__________
Repeal of Prohibition may practically require “genuine Christian belief” according to the courts so that a group can claim “We are genuine Christians and our sacrament is necessarily entheogenic.”
The court might argue “You are esotericists, which means you disbelieve in any particular religion, such as Christianity. We know that esoteric Christianity is not literalist Christianity and therefore esoteric Christianity is not genuine Christian belief, therefore you are not permitted by us to use the entheogenic sacrament (which has no traditional precedent anyway).”
__________
The Egodeath theory affirms and welcomes in an alliance, a qualified kind of unity:
o Esotericists who are anti-exoteric
o Esotericists who are pro-exoteric
o Exotericists who are anti-esoteric
o Exotericists who are pro-esoteric
Personally, I am an esotericist who is pro-exoteric Christianity. I am an esoteric Christian, and I love and identify with exoteric Christians.
It’s difficult to be an esoteric Christian because of the contentious issue of no-free-will. See Valentinian Freewill Compatibilism.
I disagree with many views of exoteric Christians, such as John MacArthur’s argument that ‘wine’ for primitive Christians was non-alcoholic.
I enjoy and support many sermons by exoteric pastors, and I consider Christianity to be largely uplifting, providing a societal and moral foundation on which esotericism can rest.
Challenge: Having to bracket off this personal choice from other people affirming the Egodeath theory. There is no requirement for advocates of the Egodeath theory to hold these same views on exoteric Christianity. See Corrections and Critique of Egodeath Theory.
I support Atheists, Pagans, Protestants, Catholics, Orthodox, Restorationists, exotericists, and esotericists. I grew up with Jewish religion, Christianity, New Age, Occult Esotericism, and the Human Potential Movement.
I love religion and I support people in their religiosity or spirituality. For example, in a rural area, I see churches and it warms my heart to know the wealth of high culture there, in its exoteric form and high esoteric potential.
I love and support Christians and Christianity, my main people and culture from whence I came. Christians are my people, my culture, my family.
Christianity historically interacted with Greek elements. Greek elements are culturally native and local to historical Christianity, more than Vedanta or Northern European Paganism.
The Egodeath theory 
If there are original human beings or an original cell and from those and that sprang many more, and in doing so, each new generation changes in stature, and cultural beliefs…
Years upon years, the birth of the philosophic mind, the poetic heart, the musical soul, the scholarly thinker and the theologian..
Can anyone ever say that any one of those people are not human beings, having branched from the same origin. And if not, then how can it be any different for the spreading and changes of and in religion.
What matters is the core, the hub of religion. What sprouts from the hub, like spokes on a wheel, can never be denied their origin.
The government divides and separates.
That’s what the government thrives on.
I see the Egodeath Theory as absorbing all religion.
LikeLike
The Egodeath Theory was born through mystic altered state experience.
Readjusting the Egodeath Theory through and for the ordinary world mindset is exactly what literalism has done with authentic religion.
LikeLike
I’m so sorry Michael if any of my comments seem harsh and coming to you too often now. I will work on that.
I gasped when I saw that no free will and free will are both reasonable to conclude from the Egodeath Theory.
I wondered what happens to the frozen future world snake line. I wondered what happens to the Controller, God. If God is sensed in the mystic altered state and no longer sensed in the ordinary wotld mindset then what does that say for God and our potential to feel God within us all the time.
Doesn’t that tend to separate the mystic altered state from the ordinary world state of consciousness even more than what literalism has already done.
I apologize if any of this is irritating for you…. I am just afraid that the Egodeath Theory will be totally deboned one day, that its integrity, its backbone will dissolve.
I’m so happy to see that you love your Christian life. In the name of God that is a beautiful thing and so important as we live our lives in this world. The Egodeath Theory is not a hindrance for that at all.
The Egodeath Theory embraces all religion.
But who am I to say what should or shouldn’t be done. I just love the Egodeath Theory so much.
LikeLike
When guilt and doubt become superimposed upon a preferred and loved religious practice, it’s only God reminding us that we are human and that our periscope sometimes turns outward.
LikeLike
I folded my replies into blog posts.
“… if any of my comments seem harsh and coming to you too often”
They didn’t seem harsh, too often, or irritating — because you understand the Egodeath theory, such as the main ideas. My main concern is that people understand the main ideas of the Egodeath theory. For the most profitable disussion, a person should accurately and consistently understand and represent the Egodeath theory.
See Corrections and Critique of Egodeath Theory.
_______________________
“… that no free will and free will are both reasonable to conclude from the Egodeath Theory”
I didn’t exactly conclude free will; rather, I formulated a particular, heavily qualified definition or conception of ‘freewill’ and ‘compatibilism’, for the purpose of discussing the Egodeath theory with the many people who cannot countenance no-free-will, and who treat no-free-will as an immediate total dealbreaker which prevents learning the Egodeath theory.
See Valentinian Freewill Compatibilism.
___________________________
“… happy to see that you love your Christian life”
I support Atheists, Pagans, Protestants, Catholics, Orthodox, Restorationists, exotericists, and esotericists. I grew up with Jewish religion, Christianity, New Age, Occult Esotericism, and the Human Potential Movement. I love religion and I support people in their religiosity or spirituality.
See the present blog post, Difficulties of Being an Esoteric Christian.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Thank you so much for explaining and for understanding!
LikeLiked by 1 person
Through metaphor, myth and religions, there exists the personifications of characters and gods. From that projection onto us throughout most of our lives, we tend to want to personify God, which can interfere in our thinking about no- free-will and free will. We are limited in how we can relate with God other than through our person, our heart, our soul.
We place expectations and limitations onto God, rather than accepting God as everything.
How could it be any other way.
LikeLike
When I read your writings under ‘Valentiniam Freewill Compatibilism’ I was able to move past the conflict regarding free will and no-free-will.
It started when was i reading “And the answer is to believe them both with all your heart.”
And then I realized that
freewill is true when it is believed to be true. Just as what is already determined is believed to be true.
Free will then may become believed as no-free-will when God, the Controller is experienced in the world of the Holy Spirit.
People may believe that no-free-will is negative until we remember stories like ‘Footprints in the Sand’ when God is carrying us during our times of adversity. God is always with us. Why would we ever want that to be different.
Thank you!
LikeLike
Freewill thinking is our default, initial, animal-like, daily mode of experiencing & thinking.
The ordinary state of consciousness is the freewill mode of experiencing & thinking.
Freewill & no-free-will aren’t just two different theoretical philosophies or world-models, as conceptualized in the ordinary state; they are two different modes of experiencing; 2 different experiential states, where each state gives rise to a different conceptual model.
That’s true of Sam Harris, who wrote a book advocating the no-free-will view, and who wrote a pro-entheogens Spirituality book.
LikeLike
This following paragraph that you wrote in your blog is such a treasure.
“In the Egodeath Theory, text successfully describes the dynamics to everyone regardless of their mystic state firsthand experience. My public text references public bible texts.”
One definition of ‘dynamics’ is;
“The branch of mechanics concerned with the motion of bodies under the force of action. ”
The focus on the word ‘dynamics’ isn’t on what is seen or heard or felt during experience but rather on the actual process of change/transition itself which produces the various experiences along the way.
I am so grateful to read this one paragraph as it helps put everything into place…..Bam. just like that.
LikeLike
Yes. It’s just that after experience and returning to daily world living, the mind (not all minds revert back to a free will belief.) It’s like the return of the mind back into daily living ordinary state of consciousness has been converted into no-free-will belief, for both states of consciousness.
I don ‘t see it as a conflict anymore. I don’t see them as opposites. I see them as each one having its own place..
LikeLike
Your depth and breadth of religion is absolutely phenomenal.
LikeLike
What does TM after Catholic church stand for?
LikeLike
TM indicates “trademark”; joke meaning the official, institutional, top-down controlled Catholic Church, as a powerful political hierarchical institution which has the power to excommunicate and to not share their official Eucharist meal (and its salvation) with outsiders, even though those outsiders consider themselves real Christians. It is exclusive; anyone outside that official legal political institutional church is considered by the Catholic Church as going to hell for eternal torment & punishment.
As opposed to house-church informal grassroots gatherings of Christians, which are part of the “catholic church”.
LikeLiked by 1 person
I will always feel love for the catholic church. Certainly not for its misgivings but rather for being the exact place I was at when I had my first seizure. Sitting in a pew toward the front of the church at approximately 11/12 years old.
My father gave us belladonna pills for stomach upsets which must have been the precursor for the flashing lights, the sweet smell of incense, and the burning sensation of leaving this world and moving into another.
I wish I had known then what I do now, but at the very least, the memory of those early episodes, wipes away any negativity that I once had toward the catholic church, and instead leaves a smiling sense of love for my youth..
LikeLike
For your prayers;
Amen
In the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.
Prayer is living breath that our soul whispers to God.
Thank you
LikeLike
It’s hard at times when I look at the stations of the cross and feel the memory of the emotionaI pain I once felt for when I believed that Jesus was historical.
I wonder if there is a message in the stations of the cross when Jesus was carrying his cross and he fell three different times. And also that he died at the age of 33 so I wonder if there is something significant in the number 333.
And then of course the Trinity…
LikeLike
People might need guidance in moving from (deeply felt) exoteric literalist religion to (deeply felt) esoteric analogy-based religion.
I don’t know much about literalist Christianity, I didn’t come up through, or grow up with, intensive religion of any type. It was a spread of weak Jewish religion, minimal exposure to fundamentalist literalist Restorationist Church of Christ, moderate cultural Christendom in various churches occasionally, moderate exposure to New Age, Occult, & Human Potential. A cafeteria plan.
Catholicism is a different religion than the mostly Protestant-type exposure I had, occasionally sitting in varied church services and Sunday school. I don’t even know the denominations I was taken to; somewhat Orthodox, maybe Episcopal; a changing assortment of mainline denominations but never a Catholic mass.
I fully support literalist Christianity — but I don’t know it well, how people view and experience and think of their literalist Christianity.
LikeLike
As a child growing up in the catholic church I learned to love Jesus so very much. As a child in receiving first communion and then confirmation, we were given a little book to read which started with the words ‘Come my Jesus.’ Then there were pictures of children surrounding Jesus with the caption of “Jesus loves little children.’ God the father was too vague. Jesus appeared as real.
When I had that first seizure in the middle of Sunday mass, as a child, I had a vision of who I thought was Jesus from the back of him.
My father told me never to tell anyone that I saw Jesus so he must have known all along. As a teen I became suspicious of transubstantiation as taught by the catholic church.
When I first realized no historical Jesus it hit me so hard over the head that I felt such a loss and heartbrokeness. I went through the stages of grief that Elizabeth Kubler Ross so very well outlines. I was so terribly angry at the church with a sense of betrayal. But that is past now and there is a sense of all is well and a thankfulness for no historical Jesus.
There are just sometimes when I see images of the gentle and lean Jesus carrying the huge thick cross, that I remember the sadness I once felt for him, he who I thought was a historical Jesus.
Now I wonder how I could have ever believed that. And now as I write this I feel that I must have been brainwashed.
I hope that for the people who still believe in a historical Jesus, that with all the writings and publications available regarding myth and metaphor, their fruition into no historical Jesus will be smooth for them.
LikeLike
A lot of still active groups and forums
http://peterkirby.com/top-50-discussion-groups-bible.html
LikeLike
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/jesus/timothyfrekeandpetergandy.html
LikeLike
It really is so awesome to witness your break throughs. Every year around this time the sparks can be seen surrounding your writings. Thank you so much for sharing!
LikeLike
Wishing you a peaceful Thanksgiving, and to let you know how grateful, how thankful, I am for the Egodeath Theory and to be able to read your writings and witness your uncovering discoveries for the world to see.
I also give thanks to all the scholars who don’t quite get it yet as they provide the contrast necessary for growth through differentiation and hope that one day they may move through their boundaries and open into the space of clarity that is theirs to see and breathe from too. Happy Thanksgiving!!
LikeLike
Regarding the suppression controversy, I am a strong believer that history repeats itself. I am also a strong believer that the political realm both externally and internally have always plagued egos and the more power they get, the stronger the greed and desire for control.
And at that point, I don’t find it difficult to think that suppression was enforced in an attempt to maintain power and control of the mass.
I look at the Catholic Church and would not be surprised at all if it was partly responsible for suppression of the authentic Eucharist.
This is by far not an intellectual opinion but rather one of common sense and an awareness of human nature.
I believe that a political force has been tightly braided throughout the history of mankind from the very beginning. And where there are politics there is suppression.
LikeLike
When I think of metaphor for something such as the word ‘naked’ like you point out for ASC …I immediately and always take the ‘person’ out of the picture. It’s the ‘person’ that keeps it literal.
So then I think of things on Earth. Earth is my foundation…A tree, for example, in the winter…When the tree has lost its leaves during the fall, and trembles naked in the cold, frozen into stillness, praying for the sun.
And Earth, herself, as she must disrobe in fall, to lay beneath the blanket of snow until the frost freezes yesterday into morrow.
LikeLike
I love the image of the two snakes joining..I grew up with the caduceus with two snakes..
There is no peace that is felt as wholy as the mind union of male and female.
I see the cross as dying from the tree of possibilism. Images of Jesus on the cross are almost always showing him with his head leaning to his right, which is the left of the cross as we see it.
So it is no wonder that some images of debranched trees might show the left of the tree as debranched as seen from this view to the view of the tree.
However, within the realm of death from the tree of possibilism, the left side of the tree as we see it from here would be the right side of the dying.
LikeLiked by 1 person